Does India run the game?

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Oct 12, 2008

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By Will 9 months ago Leave a comment on this post

I find the sacking of Steve Bucknor a real worry. He was at fault numerous times in the Sydney Test, and from this bystander’s perspective didn’t appear to handle the pressure at all competantly. But what right do India have to threaten the abandonment of a tour unless an official is replaced?

Where does this end? What if his replacement in the next Test - Billy Bowden - has a similar shocker, and makes six or seven errors which, India feel, cost them the next Test? Will he too be stood down at the bequest of an agitated India?

India alone contribute 70% of the game’s finances, and in that respect they do run the game. Heck - three New Zealanders have been banned from appearing in a film by their employers, the BCCI, because of their involvement in the Indian Cricket League!

This sets a horrible precedent. Will umpires who are sent to officiate in India Tests now decline or go on strike? Why would they want to work on a Test in which they don’t have the full backing of their employer?

So, does India run cricket now or not? Oh, and incidentally - India say the tour will go ahead, but only if the ICC overturn the banning of Harbhajan Singh. This is an utter outrage. How can they be allowed to behave in this way?

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Tags: australia, billy-bowden, Harbhajan-Singh, india, india in australia, race row, steve-bucknor, umpiring |

Comments to “Does India run the game?” v wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 7.11 pm

Bucknor had this coming for a long time, mucked up the world cup final then add his visa problems which prevented him from officiating in the Aus-SL series and now this. Anyway i don’t want to get into that, but coming to your question, it goes without saying that without India you would just have Australia and England slugging it out against each other like the good ol times.

Aravindan wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 7.13 pm

So yeah, now India runs the cricket…

and what punter says stands on the field, which means Aussies run the match they play in…

do i see a 3rd world war starting somewhere?

v wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 7.34 pm

Cricinfo carries the same article as do a dozen other places but tell me where has the BCCI stated that the future of the tour is dependent on a favorable outcome to the Harbhajan hearing other than that blog, whereas the article in the sporting news section of times doesn’t mention anything of that sort.

I’m sure you can read the original press release from BCCI if you tried, so stop making baseless allegations.

Michael wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 7.50 pm

Completely agree with you Will. One only needs to turn to some of the fanatical comments in other threads to understand how far some people are willing to go in terms of demands and outrage.

libero wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 8.14 pm

While it can’t be argued that without India many teams wouldn’t be able to remain professional the fault lies with the ICC. It has been the ICC, ultimately, who have put money their first priority and thereby made the BCCI as powerful as it is. Let’s not forget that India needs international cricket as well because the domestic game isn’t particularly popular.

I also feel sorry for Bucknor because all of his mistakes were ones that anyone could have made. I am more disappointed with the 3rd umpire who didn’t give symonds for a stumping even with all of the replays available.

gringo wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 8.38 pm

v:
Doesn’t the idea that the “BCCI stated that the future of the tour is dependent on a favorable outcome to the Harbhajan hearing” show that the BCCI completely disregard the game’s authorities? It means that you cannot have a fair and independent review of the Bhajji case — if he is cleared then everyone will always be saying that he was only cleared because of the BCCI, not because he deserves to be cleared!

Of course, the equivalent is that the Aussies could threaten not to play in Perth if Hogg is not cleared!

Everyone is being completely childlike, Aussies and Indians alike!

Homer wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 10.47 pm

Will,
I am sorry, maybe I missed something, but how did you draw the conclusion thats India threatened to abandon the tour till Steve Bucknor was replaced?

Also, and you will be more aware of this than me, Rudi Koetzen did not stand in the SL-England series following his shocker at Hobart - this on the request of the SL Board. No shock there eh?

And with respect to the tour, I asked Patrick this and I ask you - where in the BCCI statement is it mentioned that the future of the tour is hinged on the Harbhajan Singh verdict by the Appelete Commision?

david black wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 10.50 pm

The BCCI is a bullying thug. It constantly throws its weight around, and its behaviour this time is despicable. It’s so sad to see principle ignored for money. The other nations should refuse to play India until it accepts it has to abide by the same rules as everyone else. The game could survive perfectly well without India - the players would simply earn less.

raxar wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 10.57 pm

No, of course India does not run the game. If they did, they’d get much more of the revenues derived from the Indian market.

Bucknor’s dismissal is a bit of a worry: stuffing him into 3rd umpire for the rest of the series might have been a better compromise… but there are days when umpires have bad days and then there’s Steve Bucknor having a bad day. His performance was as woeful as it gets in Test cricket (of course, nothing compares to the incompetence of the World Cup final).

The REAL worry is not India being able to change umpires at whim, but the tit-for-tat allegations of racial abuse. Proctor’s actions have shown that any captain can simply play the racial abuse card and get away with it. Kumble’s (childish) response of ‘you accuse our spinner and we’ll accuse yours’ opens a pandora’s box. (Although, to be honest, the childishness of this action makes me think that Kumble’s been pressured into it. I would find it difficult for Hogg to sledge at all: his tongue spends most of its time hanging out of his mouth, rather than flapping around inside it.)

gringo wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 10.57 pm

Agreed, David — the BCCI is a bullying thug.

By throwing their weight around, and by not pursuing change through existing processes, they are fast turning this whole farce into an issue about their behaviour rather than anything else.

bongopondit wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 11.07 pm

As one commentator pointed out, show me where BCCI demanded Bucknor be thrown out before the tour can recommence.

I am no fan of the BCCI and neither are a great majority of Indians. BCCI has done more harm than good for Indian cricket. But as you admit, they make the most amount of money . In any kind of a corporate scenario wouldn’t the largest shareholder throw their weight around? Like it or not, cricket is about money these days and that the money-center is in the subcontinent. Get used to it and stop whining

Btw, Indians have complained to ICC against Bucknor numerous times in the past and yet precious little has been done. He continues to be in the Elite Panel. Isn’t that proof Indians dont control the ICC ?

Your turn Will.

Homer wrote:
January 8th, 2008 at 11.29 pm

gringo,

enlighten me - Saurav Ganguly gave Steve Bucknor 0 marks during our tour Down Under. And yet, the ICC found Mr Bucknor competent enough to officiate the finals of the World Cup - which was an unmitigated disaster. And then stand for the Sydney test. So, do existing processes ( captains to rate umpires and those ratings to impact whether the umpire stays in the Elite panel or not) work?

It is because existing processes dont work that we find ourselves in this debate every couple of years. It is because the ICC, as it functions today, is a mess that we have incidents happening ever so often.

And lets not talk the BCCI and money - the ICC and its other members are equally greedy. Why else would England have a 7 match ODI set with India both home and away or the Australians play us at Kuala Lampur?
And what of the Champions Trophy and grounds free of any advertising not mandated by the ICC?

And what about “ambush marketing”?

And what of people having to drink only ICC mandated colas and to eat only ICC mandated chips - the BCCI did not force that on the ICC.

13th Man wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 12.35 am

Ummm, the Indians are on record for those statements. Unfortunately, I can’t immediately find print references, but ‘Cheatin’ Chaun has been seen on Australian TV saying exactly that. Outright blackmail.
Bucknor should have gone - but not at the behest of the BCCI. Indians refuse to believe that most Australians agree he had a shocker (and if Indians really don’t believe that Sachin and Laxmann’s lives at about 30 in their respective century innings had an equal if not greater potential impact on the game, they’re mad), and that he needs a rest. He’s been off key since at least the ODI World Cup, and we aqcknowledge that. However, it’s not for any national body to dictate that - as soon as the BCCI started to throw it’s weight around - yet again - any move to drop him should have halted, the Indians having brought that upon themselves. Pakistan set an ugly precedent when, with Indian collusion, they ousted Hair. Pretty soon world cricket will only be offciated by subcon approved officials, and that’ll be the end of cricket.
Remember: Indian and Pakistani umpires forced the adoption of the Elite Panel due to their blatant corruption.
For those who contend that India has complained about Bucknor before - I think everyone has. I - and most of those whom I know - groan when we hear the man is presiding over an OZ v … match. We know he is hopeless. I feel the same way about Kuertzen and Dar - but that’s life. I could name plenty of dodgy decisions against Oz - but as I’ve said before, truly great teams rise above bad umpiring, or accept that they weren’t up to par (we lost the ‘05 Ashes because a) England were better, and b) we were appalling - bad umpiring really only exacerbated that, but bad playing brings bad luck with the umps, as we’ve all seen many times before). India must accept that, while they did play better in Sydney than in Melbourne, they still weren’t good enough. Failure to bat out 70 overs (not even considering blatant ‘go-slow’ tactics for which they should be cited) cost them the match, not anything else.
And this bullshit about Oz buying off the umpires and all the other conspiracy crap is ludicrous. How can Indians react so badly whenever they feel their national honour has been impougned, yet feel so free to label everyone else. What pathetic hypocrites.

Ryan wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 12.42 am

It is an outrage. It is also an outrage that a player has been blighted with the racist tag on the basis of one person saying so, a person with a decidedly crap reputation for honesty on the cricket field.

This whole fiasco has been handled ineptly by everyone concerned, players/administrators/umpires/media, and the sooner it blows over and is recognized for the infantile little squabble it is the better for the game. This being cricket however, i don’t have high hopes.

gringo wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 1.20 am

Homer, I am not saying that the ICC works well. I despise its’ rampant commercialism, its’ fixation on one-day and 2020 cricket, and its’ prioritisation of making money over bettering cricket.

I am saying that it is better to try and resolve these things from within the system rather than letting the world game slide into a disarray where everyone bends to the demands of the BCCI! I don’t know … maybe that is the stage at which we already are.

The BCCI have the power to positively change cricket, but are misusing this power. There is no way that Bhajji’s appeal can be given any credibility since the BCCI have already demanded that the ICC clear him or else they will abandon the tour.

Stew wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 1.56 am

The Indians have decided that they will continue with the tour today. This is great news because it means that cricket will continue. What’s not so great is that they are still saying that if Harbhajan’s suspension is not dismissed that they will still call off the tour.
Is this not the most blatant case of blackmail in the history of cricket? How dare the BCCI hold cricket to ransom in this way.
Harbhajan has been reported and has been suspended, and the natural course of justice has been followed to the letter of the law. His right of appeal still stands, but to threaten to pull out of the tour should it not be dismissed reaks of a far greater arrogance than what you are all accusing the Australians of displaying on the field.

Homer wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 2.00 am

gringo,

In bhajji’s case, if there is sufficient evidence, hang him.But what we have here is the word of one player over the other. No umpires, no stump mics, nothing that could be construed as neutral. And yet the Match referee feels compelled to award a three match ban AND condemn a man as a racist on that basis alone.

The match referee is an ICC appointee.. Is this then, the ICC definition of due process?

Maybe, and just maybe, we need to chuck the existing “processes”. There is way too much bad blood and antipathy on account of them.

Homer wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 2.23 am

also, by all accounts, Steve Bucknor had a shocker at Sydney. By all accounts, he is past his prime.So pray tell me, why did it require the BCCI to “flex its muscles” ( if indeed that is the case) to get Bucknor out of the Perth test? Isnt this something that the ICC should have done proactively ?

Or is the suggestion here that inept and incompetent umpires are par for course - that Bucknor should have stood just to spite the BCCI?

gringo wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 2.30 am

I agree that there needs to be changes to the process (ie. the hearing held by the ICC match referee, and the subsequent appeal, which don’t even know when is going to happen!). We don’t know anything about how Proctor came to his conclusion, and that lack of transparency has obviously caused outrage. I agree completely that, on what we know, there isn’t any evidence other than the word of the Aussies that Bhajji said anything.

These disputes need to be resolved by someone independent of the disagreeing countries. The ICC has failed (so far) here, but I really don’t think that the BCCI threatening not to play unless the ICC finds Bhajji not guilty is a very constructive way to solve it.

Thinking about it, I think that everyone has handled this terribly. Ponting should have just gone and talked to Kumble and Harbajhan after play, and said that he had a problem, and Bhajji should have just said that he didn’t actually say that but that he is sorry for any offense that was mistakenly taken.

And instead of everyone being so gung-ho about it, we could just focus on getting better umpires and enjoying the cricket. Now I’m dreaming …

pod wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 2.42 am

13th man,

you happily admit that steve bucknor has been below par for a while.. well, if india didn’t make a fuss, he’d still be here… so i don’t know what the problem is… he was past his prime.. he had to go.. the icc didn’t have the balls, india pushed him out.. simple.. that’s pretty much what you’re saying, and i don’t see anything wrong in it..

why don’t you get the basic point? the accusation against bhajji is one man’s word against another’s… you believe the aussie version, we don’t… i’d much rather believe sachin… you don’t want to, that’s your choice…

you say that the indians “still weren’t goo enough”.. ya right.. after having 8 decisions go against you, and getting a first innings lead.. it’s pretty easy to say..

indians being hypocritical? i think a lot of people throwing the blame on india are OBTUSE.. wake up.. when reasonable arguments don’t seem to enter your heads, then the tough facts of life ought to.. and that is plain and simple.. india is where the money lies, and today, money rules the game…

all boards around the world are party to this phenomenon…

Richard wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 3.30 am

Umpires are just gonna have to learn to give sub-continental teams the benefit of the doubt from now on. This Bucknor fellow needs to learn respect the new lords and masters of cricket.

Really, they should just employ an elite panel of Indian umpires for the remaining two tests and all will be right with the world.

Michael wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 3.41 am

Yes but what can we do about India’s fielding and running between the wickets?

Perhaps two’s should automatically be given three when batting and mis-fields on the boundary that go for four should be reduced to three?

What other rules can we come up with?

bongopondit wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 3.49 am

@Michael:

6 for boundaries and 8 for over-boundaries. At the same time, reduce Australia’s total by a handicap of the win margin in previous test. These should help !

Keep stretching this any way you want, what you haven;t got is answers to the legit questions asked on this post: why didn’t ICC remove Bucknor earlier, why isn’t ICC offering a full explanation of Harbhajan’s removal etc.

Of course, replying with sarcasm and evading the main issue are much easier.

Chris wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 4.14 am

And on the subject of fair play and walking when out, check out this beauty - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3Ms37yt3lg - Does Singh have something against big hitting part time offspinners who don’t play for the country they were born in?

OX wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 4.16 am

Does it strke anyone else as ironic that India are complaining about umpires?

For decades, when umpires were not neutral it was common knowledge you didn’t get LBWs against India, in India, and look out if you yourself were hit on the pads while one off their spinners was bowling!

Remember all the stories of umpires in India (and Pakistan for that matter) having their homes burnt down after unfavourable decisions)?

Richard wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 4.25 am

The topic of this thread is “does India run the game?”. If that’s the main issue then I’m saying that I for one welcome our new Indian overlords.

…and it’s still a higher form of wit than calling a bloke a monkey.

Amitabh wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 6.42 am

The pandemonium that was taking place in the middle in the 5 days of the 2nd test match made India lose the test match. Anyone who knows cricket will have to admit that for the greater part of the test match anyone could have won the match. It’s not just the BCCI’s but any other cricketing body’s right to protest against such discrimination, even if it was unintentional. More importantly, what Bucknor and the other umpires(including his on-field partner and the third umpire) have proved is that they are incompetent, and why should India, or any team for that matter, play a match if they are not convinced of the capability, and hence reliability, of the judges of the game. Give it a thought!
Also, please don’t make it an India vs Aus issue. Though one must admit that the way Australians are trying to find loopholes in the rule books is pretty shameful.
Let’s be honest, irrespective of one’s nationality, that Australians like to chatter on the wicket but can’t take it if the opposition retorts.
And our dear 13th man, you are just too rude to be here. Remember, if there is one country whose bowlers have never tried to use “mental disintegration” to get wickets then that’s India. Getting an elite umpiring club is a good step, the reasons immaterial. You also write that you have seen plenty of decisions going against Oz, please remind us of one which was lopsided to such an extent as the match in contention due to poor umpiring. Just don’t lose your wits because it’s your team which is on the other side.

Rusty wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 7.22 am

I see having got Bucknor’s head on a platter, the Indians are now going for Proctor. They claim their players were very upset at the way they were treated by the English lawyer at the hearing, and were “roughly handled”. Hate to think quite what THAT one means.

How far will the Indians go? They are already rapidly losing support here, after initial sympathy.

Good sense of humour, Richard

pod wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 7.28 am

i don’t think losing support anywhere else other than india shaould make an iota of a difference to the indian team.. at this juncture especially… i would like to think that it is the australian team that should be worried about losing support among its OWN supporters…

anyway, here’s an article which could be of interest:

http://www.hindustantimes.com/StoryPage/FullcoverageStoryPage.aspx?id=32f6ef94-5f29-405a-983a-03eb848c8e84IndiainAustralia_Special&MatchID1=4617&TeamID1=3&TeamID2=4&MatchType1=1&SeriesID1=1163&PrimaryID=4617&IsCricket=true&Headline=When+Ponting+let+the+crisis+happen

Rusty wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 7.30 am

Dear Amitabh

“Remember, if there is one country whose bowlers have never tried to use “mental disintegration” to get wickets then that’s India.”

Harbhajan is the only cricketer I have heard of being cited for trying to intimidate an umpire. Indian bowlers don’t use mental disintegration against opposing teams -they just go for umpires.

utkarsh wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 7.49 am

I dont agree with your point of view at all.
Steve Bucknor’s sacking was not a knee jerk reaction from an agitated BCCI and the visibly upset team. He has had a history of bad decisions against teams from sub-continent. And of course, other than the fact, that he is incompetent to umpire at international level (at 62 years of age), its his arrogance and stubbornness that is more of an issue. How can someone trust his eyes from 25 feet when there is a keep appealing for a stumping from 4 feet. Any umpire in the world (even the oens at junior levels) would have referred that to the third umpire (not that it would have made a difference .. the third umpire is as much at fault as any of the on field umpires for not intervening when required and giving bad decision in spite of having the technology in place)
I do feel though that India should not have stopped at just bucknor .. Benson was at his incompetent best too. Going by your logic that all umpires who commit mistakes are being banned because of BCCI money, even Benson would have been booted out .. and as the situation is .. he isn’t.
And the Harbhajan issue is more a matter of pride than anything else. We Indians pride in calling ourselves tolerant of other cultures and have the world’s biggest mix of cultures possible. No one from India would ever insult any one on the basis of the color of his skin. When all the dust has settled on this issue and if Harbhajan is still remembered as racist, then its not a matter of pride for an Indian.
The problem is more strange because of the manner in which hearing was conducted. So far on this tour, it seems that the Aussie word holds more importance than an Indian’s word. Be it the Michael Clarke’s catch of Ganguly or be it the the hearing for the racist claims. when there is no evidence to prove things either way, how can the match refree go ahead and slap a 3 match ban on one of India’s most promising bowlers.

Amitabh wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 8.12 am

Rusty,

I am not quite sure how you will corroborate what you are saying. Intimidating an umpire today, when laws are so restrictive that Sehwag(I think in australia in 2003-04) got penalized for appealing for too long, is not something that wouldn’t get reported.
If you try to think up a few names of bowlers who carried themselves as real gentlemen on the field (not that I eulogize that aspect of theirs, but that’s subjective) those that come to mind instantaneously are Srinath, Walsh, Ambrose, Prasad, Kumble and the like.
On another note, to be very honest, to the contrary I have felt that Indian players are penalized for the same acts that other teams get away with. The Sehwag incident mentioned above is just one of the many. And actually the general feeling in India has been that the BCCI doesn’t do enough to protect the discrimination against its players.
I see what you are trying to drive at but that’s more witty than logical. In fact, you just reminded me of Ponting’s bravado — raising the finger — on the field when the umpire approached him after a controversial catch. The umpire wasn’t apparently aware of his limits as an on-field umpire(he ought to have consulted the leg umpire and not any player) and Ponting was just too full of himself to keep himself from a little bit of histrionics. That act of raising the finger wasn’t friendly to say the least. He should take a leaf out of Taylor’s or Waugh Sr.’s book regarding how to create a better impression on people.

JM wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 8.17 am

India did not threatened to pull out if Bucknor officiated. They just rightly said he was “incompetant”

India threatened to pull out if Harbhajan’s ban is not lifted.
It was an Aussie’s word against Indian’s. Aussies won, no evidence!

Ashutosh Singh wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 8.30 am

do you know anything about the incident or just making all the bullshit in your blog.
Tell me one thing if bucknor given so many wrong decisions why there was not a single decision against the Australia.

I must say that BCCI is again a wast organization they only care for the money otherwise they should have been lodge a case against bucknor and benson stating them racist because they took the advise of a white player not the batsman and given all wrong decision against India only.why is it so.
I think this match was totaly fixed and bucknor and benson got hell lot of money for all the decisions In my openion this match should be cancelled and should be played again.
and don’t try to act smart you moron.

Ashutosh Singh wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 8.31 am

U are a serious moron.

Ashutosh Singh wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 8.32 am

Yes BCCI and India Run the game. Do whatever you can do.
let’s wait those Aussies come to India then we will show them how we play the cricket.
and you will also get to know .

Amitabh wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 9.01 am

Cease fire! We are not fighting the australians or the australian team here, we are making a point against pathetic umpiring and the hearing of the alleged racist-slur showered by Harbhajan in which the result was not in compliance with the evidence — call that democracy whoever wants to, not me.

khaleel wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 9.21 am

we provide the money. and we will run the game as we wish. no one questions our integrity. hehhehe

khaleel wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 9.27 am

hey this is cheating. wen i click the no button it says that it is invalid poll. only yes votes are getting registered.
typical aussie blog.

Stephen wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 12.31 pm

Ashutosh Singh ………… you sir are a rude pig, the India Laison officer was asked on the news tonight is this a form of blackmail, he put his head down and would not answer the question ……. hhhmmm (suppose we are lucky he didn’t come out with a rascist slur).

Why did Sachin come of and say he did not think what was said was derogatory, then later said Singh said nothing, are the Indians trying to avoid 4-0.

Think on this all our bloggers in India, why when Sachin got down to the 10 & 11 batsmen in the first innings did he take the single of the first ball ????? Don’t tell me he had confidence ……… or was he just trying to protect his not out status. Gangulay in the first test when edging a catch to short leg stood straight up and shook his head before the umpire could raise his finger (but Indians don’t try to influence the umpire), then again old Gangers is a cheat from way back …….. by the way boys how is your mate Azza going living on all his dirty money ????

There we have it the difference between Aus & India an Aussie plays for the team and an Indian plays for himself.

Having said all that the umpires were shocking (for both sides) one side got on with it and the other side saw it as a way out. The Aussies need to tone their aggresion down, the Indians need to grow some balls. We all know racsist Harbi will get off (what a pig), Hogg will be hung out to dry.

Bring on Perth ……. you Indians are going to love Shaun Tait ………….. hahahaha …….

Richard wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 1.10 pm

Wow Ashutosh Singh, you’re pretty fired up there champ. You’re not Harbijan’s sister are you?

Take a deep breathe, wait a couple of weeks and when the series is a 4-0 whitewash these issues will all be academic.

khaleel wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 2.35 pm

ideally the second test match should be cancelled and another match should be organized since india has well lost a match which it should have ideally won.
there is no credible evidence whether harbhajan has called symonds as monkey or not. except that you said , i did not say statements. if he has indeed said then he should be banned for 3 - 5 tests since it would be unfair and demeaning to compare ancestors of human race with a cheat / fraud.
its been a wonderful lesson for the aussie team so far.

lets hope that the “learned” and articulate (in sledging) captain and team members of aussie team will take a word or two from the past greats of aussie cricket team like john bertrand, neil harvey ,mark taylor and from icc’s advice to CA. not to mention the lashing of peter roebuck in his column. any sensitive thinking captain would have resigned by this moment.

they do play hard and fair in dishing out comments on other players. but when retaliated they dont have the so called ” sportmanship” or spirit of Australia to take it back.

we cannot expect any fair play or honesty when we play with this team. it wud be fantastic to watch “panting cry baby” ponting becoming a bunny to bhaji once again.

Quote:
“how is your mate Azza going living on all his dirty money ????”

in the same way markwaugh and shanewarne are living on the money they got from giving pitch reports to bookers. (only this fraud has come to light)god knows what other frauds they have committed!!!!

Tom P wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 4.29 pm

Sheesh - this is ridiculous.

1. I havent seen (nor has anyone else been able to provide) any statement from the BCCI that they would withdraw from the tour of Singh wasnt declared innocent.

2. If there is proof that Singh said something racist (and I think using the word monkey qualifies considering the history - even though I know it isnt racist in India) it should be brought out. Right now it seems like one word against another.

3. Bucknor was really bad this test - and has been bad for a while.

4. The reason India complained and not Oz is because they were the ones hurt by the decisions. Oz would have done the same if they were hit so bad.

Vineet Raj Kapoor wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 6.59 pm

Is monkey a racial abuse?
Mostly, No! Well it matter about what we think about our forefathers - monkeys. I think here we would need a dictionary of racist words since a lot of words are confusing. Is Gay a racist word? Is bastard (uttered by Brad Hogg for the Captain Anil Kumble) racist? Well, one thing is certain. Monkey may be abusive to some extent, but ranks way below Bastard and F***er.

Stephen wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 8.01 pm

Vineet Raj Kapoor ……….. when “Monkey” is used against a man for the coulour of his skin …….. is racist.

When the BCCI turned a blind eye in the one day series last year the whole world saw a new side to India, so here is hoping good old Racist Harbi gets what he deserves. Maybe you should come out here and call a black man a bastard and then a monkey and see which one will get you knocked out quicker.

Michael wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 8.10 pm

Good on ya khaleel, this blog is a British blog. Insert your anti-white remark here now.

BongoP'o'ndit wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 10.20 pm

sigh ! everyone’s gone crazy now.

@OX: You said “For decades, when umpires were not neutral it was common knowledge you didn’t get LBWs against India, ”
Ever watched the tied test between India-aus at Chennai. What nationality was the umpire who gave Maninder Singh out ‘lbw’ to Greg Mathews when Indian needed just another run to win.

Know your game before you comment.

OX wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 10.32 pm

I know quite a bit about the game actually and I had that decision in mind when I wrote the comment, - but if one thing overrode home town bias in those days, it was a chance to “go down in history” as the centre of attention during the second ever tied Test.

Ever wondered why that tie doesn’t get as much publicity as the real tied test in Brisbane, because of a useless umpiring decision that back then, did actually cost India the match. A hopeless decision made by an umpire far worse the Steve Bucknor. “It’s the one exeption that proves the rule” - thanks for pointing it our.

Stu wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 10.35 pm

There was some chat earlier about India trying to avoid a 4 nil whitewash. (Frankly, as much as I oppose the action, I doubt that is the motivation).

I would assume though that if they boycott the rest of the tour, for the purposes of world rankings at least, it would go down as a 4 : 0 whitewash. (And what of the ODI rankings?)

Does anyone know?

Stu wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 10.38 pm

A few typos there OX, but an interesting point.

Subcontinent umpiring has certainly improved by a huge magnitude over the last decade or so, despite burning efigees, death threats etc. Of course, neutral umpires probably has a lot to do with that!

gringo wrote:
January 9th, 2008 at 11.10 pm

This whole farce has reaffirmed my faith in humanity — fans of all nationalities can be one-eyed obnoxious dickheads.

Chris wrote:
January 10th, 2008 at 12.28 am

khaleel, you say India rightly should have won the test if a few decisions went their way. Mate they couldn’t bat out 70 overs. And whats with the constant repetition of it “being demeaning to monkeys to compare them with a cheat/fraud”. Get a new line fellas.

OX wrote:
January 10th, 2008 at 12.33 am

Ha! Not only couldn’t they bat 70 overs, but 3 off them couldn’t hold off a part time spinner with a bad back, who hasn’t bowled for goodness knows how many years.

Bring on 17 in a row!

BongoP'o'ndit wrote:
January 10th, 2008 at 12.40 am

@OX and Chris,

I wont say that India would have won given decisions going our way in I1 (Symond’s nick etc.) - because we had a bit of green going way as well in our I1. However, given some proper decisions in our I2 on fifth day, the match could have certainly been drawn. Given that Australia played marginally better cricket on Days 4 and 5, I was actually happy with India’s performance as well.

Its the bad decisions and the added non-essential drama on the 5th day that ruined it. Without it, and given the same result (India’s loss) I would have been disappointed but still excited about having watched a thrilling and close match.

Stephen wrote:
January 10th, 2008 at 11.23 am

khaleel ……. it must really hurt knowing that the mother of all cheats is and Indian, good old Azza.

Have to admit old Harbi would have way to much pride to cheat (except for the non-stop appealing ….. but Indian’s don’t pressure umpires), a racist pig yes a cheat no. Maybe next time he will think of the pride stakes before he lets himself and his countrymen down with the racist comments.

pod wrote:
January 10th, 2008 at 3.10 pm

Hi Stephen.. poor old Azza also gets brought in here.. suffering from selective memory perhaps? how about the (then) ACB’s covering up of the whole warne-junior waugh affair? and the greatest spinner of all time’s assertion that his mum gave him some pills which were banned… hehe

there’s no end to this man.. india and australia have produced some really great cricketers.. the three named above i hold in very high regard… i just wish we could come together sometime and rave over someone’s cover drive, or a stunning catch, or a beautiful delivery.. a great inning.. anything of that nature..

i for one, really hope there are no more obstacles that prevent this tour from moving on ahead.. it is a rivalry to cherish.. it is the last time i will get to see sachin, dravid and laxman bat in australia.. anything and everything else is trivial…

Vineet Raj Kapoor wrote:
January 10th, 2008 at 6.55 pm

This match was dominated by India throughout so it hurt a lot when it was the umpires that swung the game from them everyday again and again.

Who did Azza cheat? It was his own country - if indeed he did. Well we are talking here of cheating to win. And you bring in sellers!

Stephen, somewhere up there! Well, we are talking of a bunch of wild dogs as Roebuck liked to call (though that is not racist), you could see the spirit of the match in Pontings’s face which said it all - “I tell you we are no 1 - you are out!”

That is NOT Done!!!

Vineet Raj Kapoor wrote:
January 10th, 2008 at 7.00 pm

Monkey may be racist in Australia, but Bastard is sacrilege in India. And Monkeys are Gods here!

Hey Symonds, what about moving to India?

If I am to believe some of the posts above - it seems that in some countries people are happier with questionable parentage than being related to their real ancestors. Well, let us see the jelly in Brad Hogg’s face now

Stephen wrote:
January 10th, 2008 at 9.00 pm

Vineet Raj Kapoor wrote ………. “Monkey may be racist in Australia, but Bastard is sacrilege in India. And Monkeys are Gods here!” ……….. still trying to peddle the old lies that Barjii (does that mean racist in Indian) did not mean it as a racist comment ?????

Please the man is a racist pig, he was warned in India and he just thought he was above the ICC law (like all Indian cricketers think they are), you could tell by the look on his face when he did it. Then the grovelling to Symonds at the end of the over was pathetic !!!

Bastard in Australia is used as a term of humour at times though I think it very offensive that it used anywhere, but when Brad Hogg said to Ponting at the end of the over “Can’t wait to get these bastards out” he was warned by Ponting to shut-up. Something that Peter Roebuck always forgets to mention (google Peter Roebuck on the internet and see for all his kiddy fiddling past and then think if he can pass moral judgment). You guys can bet if Brad Hogg gets suspended he won’t whine to his board, have his team mate change his story THREE times, but then again as has been proved on many occasions an Aussie cricketer is much more of a man than an Indian cricketer !!!!!!!

Chris wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 12.11 am

Hey pod, the difference with Warnie is he took his punishment on the chin. None of this “we’ll boycott the tour” hooha like from the Indian management.

Chris wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 12.15 am

Anyone remember who it was, when told that someone on his team called an opposition player a bastard, promptly walked out and said “All right! Which one of you bastards called this bastard a bastard”. I read it on cricinfo once, sort of relative as far as this argument goes.

bongopondit wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 12.23 am

@Chris: Apparently said by an Aussie player when DOuglas JArdine walked into the dressing room to complain about someone calling him a bastard. Possibly an apocryphal story, popularized in the Bodyline TV series.

Also read Rick Eyre’s blog: http://www.rickeyre.com/blog/node/1546

Stu wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 12.38 am

An excellent point Chris - no boycotting of the World Cup, which we just went on and won without Warney

Not sure of the true origins of the “bastards” quote, but it was used in the “Bodyline” mini-series back in the early 1980’s - a complaint was made by Douglass Jardine that he’d been called a bastard, (go figure!), and he reported it after the day’s play to the Australian dressing room, to which Bill Woodfull turned and replied with the quote you’ve mentioned.

Maybe some interesting parallels could be drawn here.

pod wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 1.34 am

chris,

cheating and then saying, yes i cheated after getting caught is only slightly better than saying i didn’t do it in the first place.

but anyway, i get what you mean. i did not intend to flare up anything here… i was very reluctant to use warne’s name here, as he’s been one of my 4 favourite cricketers over the years, alongside sachin, lara and yes, azhar…

probably couldn’t take the azhar comment well myself..

Scott wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 10.51 am

Does India run the game?..Well they like to think they do and the ICC’s behaviour in all this would suggest that the ICC are paper tigers.
The nexus of the problem here isn’t the umpires, it isn’t Australian cricketers being arrogant (In India’s eyes), it isn’t the ludicrous claims that Australian players are cheats, hell it isn’t even the blatantly racist nature of Singh. The root cause of the problem is India as a whole. Or should I say their inability as a nation of 1 billion people to actually be good at something other than telemarketing.
India for decades has struggled to accept the decision of authority or to respect the common vagaries of humanity. So why does this surprise us they are some ungracious in sport? They are inherently racist, elitist and arrogant, particularly towards Anglo-Saxons and Africans, since the end of British rule and it’s this mentality that has so deeply infected the Indian psyche. Not all I might add, but many nonetheless.

They are not mentally equipped to neither understand the rights of others nor accept that sometimes they may actually be in the wrong, and yes this includes a well respected sportsman being a racist! Their reaction to this is a churlish tantrum and some effigy burning just to ram home the fact that they are mental pygmy’s.

Until Anil Kuble’s broadside of Ricky Ponting and the Australian team at the aftermath of the 2nd test, most Aussies sympathised with India for the rough deal they got with the umpires, after all, we all want to see a game played with minimal dubious calls. But hey that’s cricket. Sadly India took it to another level, they carried on like dickheads and have subsequently brought the game into disrepute. They have left it irrevocably damaged to the point that each time India now plays the viewing public will be sceptical as to the validity of contest.

Let’s face it, no team that fields so pathetically or so lazily can claim to be elite sportspeople, let alone professionals and as a consequence they never at any stage deserved to win. I would suggest that India may need to have a very long look at its attitude towards sport in general.

The most disconcerting thing is that India have attempted to steer the issue away from the racist remarks made to Andrew Symonds to a point that it appears that Indian fans, officials and players – including Tendulkar- believe Symonds deserved to be racially vilified. Anil Kumble has no moral compass after he used the media to undermine an agreement between Pointing, Kumble, the ICC and the BCCI to report any racial abuse from either side to the umpires. Ricky Ponting has come out smelling like roses for being a moral champion against racial abuse. Anil Kumble has come out looking like a prostitute.

Stephen wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 12.53 pm

Scott ……… best comment I have read in a long time, summed the whole thing up beautifully.

Has amazed me over the last week it has gone from Bajji (which means racist pig in Indian) said nothing racist to he said nothing at all to we should have sorted it out like men behind closed doors.

The one to come out of this with his reputation sullied the most is Tendulkar, the little garden gnome should have worked out one story and stuck with it.

Everyone here in Australia was so looking forward to a great series where the home side was greatly tested (after all that was promised), also the Indians were not going to back down. What do we see but a bunch of unfit amateurs that at the first sign of a tough fight fold like a pack of cards.

Scott you realise this will cause the effigies to be flying thick and fast in down town Mumbai don’t you.

khaleel wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 1.20 pm

no matter how much explaning we do i dont understand why everything is falling in deaf ears. god save the fraud aussies.

Scott wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 1.45 pm

You are right Stephen in saying that Tendulkar came out looking like a man with a sullied reputation. Indain’s may revere him and yes in the past he has come across as a most affable person but to so openly claim that because he didn’t hear it didn’t happen and then expect that his word should be absolute is disingenuous at best.

Me thinks the video footage that clearly shows Singh uttering the ‘Monkey’ slur is more than proof positive he is a racist individual. The fact that Tendulkar is attempting to exonerate him for such behaviour shows the true character of Tendulkar and it isn’t pretty.

There was a lot to like about India’s last day’s play, not withstanding the time wasting tactics, especially Kumble’s gritty innings, but if India wanted to press home a point then they should have done what all other non-subcontinent nations do an get on with the bloody game like real me do!

The Indians have proven to be a bunch of limp dicks with a loser’s attitude. Poor me, woe is me, why don’t they just let us win for once. Pleeaassee….. Just go home India, play Bangladesh 4 times a year so you get that ‘winning feeling’ and leave us true cricketing nations in peace.

It’s amazing you know, everyone was looking forward to the Indian arrival, some thought the crowd would be hammering India for their behaviour in Mumbai, eg Sing and Srisanth, yet instead Laxmann and Tendulkar were revered for their stroke play. No racist taunts from the Aussie crowds. Many were expecting the Indians to come out as promised and give it to the Australians. Instead India fell apart like a well tampered cricket ball in the hands of Kapil Dev. I guess the intestinal fortitude it requires to play at test level is non existent in the Indian team, its officials and its fans.

PS. Yes Stephen, they will be burning more effigies and this will only help to confirm how racist and mentally challenged Indians really are.

Vineet Raj Kapoor wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 3.54 pm

I think we’ve seen enough of the australian spirit in Scott and Steve who sum it all. Execpt talking of evidence and rulings, they talk about everything. They are a pretty emotional bunch in the face of evidence. They find fault with everything india stands for including gandhi and others.

Well, if you are looking for that, let me take you through a journey of history. Unfortunately, they stand right on top of the rights of aborigines (the original inhabitants of australia) and rue the fact that one day they would have to vacate the countries they occupy, one by one they will go. First they had to leave india, and subcontinent, then parts of africa, then hongkong and later they would have to one day explain about their presence in Australia, New Zealand and USA. They never understand logic, and quiver the sight of rising China and India.

It’s clearly the white man taking advantage of the feelings of a black man and drawing him into a fight he is not interested in. Using him to draw attention away from real issues, using him to achieve some incongruous records no one is interested in. India stands by it’s sportsmen when they are tried in sham courts. We’ve seen enough of these trials without evidence in our past during different foreigner’s rules to know how these work. Now, the great australian bullying is being unravelled. I still remember the 1978-79 series and each umpiring decision of it. It was far worse than this. And still Bedi won 2 out of 5 matches. It was a series India should have won 4-1 but for the highly prejudiced umpiring. At least today we can see (those days there were no TVs). We now understand how athletes use various concoctions to bring home golds they never deserve. It is a game between science and inspectors and not between athletes any more.

Vitriol wrote:
January 11th, 2008 at 7.23 pm

I bring a vial of vitriol to the proceedings!

One thing I fail to understand: in most comments replying to the Indian complaints of poor umpiring in the 2nd Test, the common reply is “dont forget the standard of umpiring in India 30 years ago!”

I’m going to turn the tables. What if in view of the racism allegations, the Indians were to bring into attention the past of Australia. The rather racist past of Australia.

Yes the umpires in India used to be appalling in the past - but don’t forget, your grand-dad probably hunted the aborigines in the ouback like herd animals!

Standing up for a black man who was called a monkey might make you feel good about yourself - don’t forget, in the past, while Indian’s were giving bad decisions on the field, the Aussies were slaughtering an entire nation of blacks!

There’s no point picking from India’s past - as the Australian past isn’t too rosy - it’s actually quite red - with aborigine blood.

If you tell us - “Your umpires were bad then, so cop it now and stop whining,” you’ve got a thing coming! Your forefathers have killed black men, Harbhajan only called one a monkey - stop whining, cop it, move on. (BTW - If Harbhajan is guilty as per ICC regulations he should be banned.)

The point is - past umpiring decisions should not affect your currrent views just as past racial issues don’t seem to.

If you don’t feel a pang of guilt for your racist past, then we certainly don’t feel any for bad umpiring decisions in the 70s!!!

Stu wrote:
January 12th, 2008 at 9.12 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eoc_RqY6yws

Darryl wrote:
January 12th, 2008 at 10.19 pm

In response to Vitriol:
As an Australian I feel incredibly guilty about Australia’s history and the slaughter of Aborigines. I wish it had never happened, and I hope it never happens again. So, since some of us do feel guilt for our racist past, do you feel any guilt for bad umpiring decisions in the 70s?

Furthermore, are any racial taunts unacceptable, or should everyone follow your standard of “stop whining, cop it, move on”? If that’s the case, they why won’t the Indian cricket team stop whining and move on from Brad Hogg’s indiscretion?

In response to Will’s post:
Perhaps India thinks they run world cricket, but if the ICC and other cricketing nations stood up to them and said that their behaviour (calling for the sacking of Bucknor, and refusing to play in matches unless all of their conditions were met) was unacceptable, then I think they’d very quickly fall back into line.

Naveen wrote:
January 13th, 2008 at 6.40 am

Wow… I am just joining this longlist of enthusiasts. I read through a few threads and have observed that the emotions are really running high.Lets forget the cultural and political history talk and focus on cricket. A lot of things happened that shouldn’t have, but that can’t be changed.

Everyone wants to go out there and compete, and no one wants some out of form individual to spill water on their hard work. If that happens with a team mate (read Sehwag) way too often, then they axe that fellow. I guess, ICC should have a similar stand on umpires. Bucknor has been making mistakes consistently and although he has been consistently out of sorts while umpiring in series involving the Indian team, his record with the other teams ain’t that clean either. That being said, I think Benson’s hand and that of the 3rd umpire in this fiasco has been totally ignored. They are as guilty as Bucknor.

Now coming to Australia, I have always observed that the Aussie’s would aggressively comment on allegations made on them if those are not true. They are so cocky that they would point out faults with the other teams when they are accused wrongly. But surprisingly, I have not read anything about any aussie pointing fingers at the Indians because they know they have made an error. That is enough to say that the Aussie’s “have no business going crying to their board” for a fair trial because a fair trial would be a punishment for Hogg’s guilt for he has already accepted that he wont contest the charge, but instead play the cultural difference card.The aussie media is now playig games again, by accusing Ishant Sharma for using abusive language in hindi after symonds was not given out on 30. If that was the case, what about Micheal Clarke who said “F*** O**” after he claimed a double bumpcatch off Ganguly. This can potentially open a can of worms for the Aussie’s and they don’t want that. They know they will lose.

As for Bhajji, I would call him a racist pig if the powers to be could prove his guilt. Otherwise he is Innocent. And there is a lot of difference between calling a man racist and calling a man uncouth for using abusive language, both of which is unacceptable on the cricket field. However,as a matter of choice, I would prefer being called the latter.

Remember, McGrath got away with minor fines and sometimes without a hearing for spitting in front of a batsman, talking dirty and calling Sanath a “Black Monkey” all of which could be proved if charged. And then we have our very own Sreesanth who acted really weird and over aggressive in the recently concluded series. The list is endless, so lets be reasonable and not emotional.

Scott wrote:
January 13th, 2008 at 2.37 pm

Ring around a Rosie for the Indian mob. It’s like “Circle the wagons, here they come again…”
Poor old Vitriol is trying to grasp Australian history without knowing which end is his head and which end is his arse.
As for the horrible acts perpetuated against the Aboriginals, this was mainly done by the rich station owners, which in essence were either British, French or German so please don’t make a dickhead of yourself in trying to make out you actually know something other than the length of your tiny dick.
To try and use this as a means to absolve India of being cheating racist pricks is meaningless, especially given the inherently racist nature of India’s past. If you really want to get into a slanging match over who is more abhorrent in racial violence and murder India will lose hands down over any country, just ask Pakistan.
So lets get this back onto cricket shall we.
India lost the 2nd test. India promised to “take it up to the Australians”. India did not have the guts or ability to play the world’s best team at the world’s best level, so what did India do. Well firstly they sooked like a baby to cover up their inability to be anything of significance, and then they claimed everyone cheated. Hell, I wouldn’t have been surprised to hear that the taxi drivers were in on it.

Throughout all this India have showed their total lack of maturity in accepting they are a racist and elitist bunch of superior beings. Instead, they have for some obscure reason called all Australians cheats, liars and now killers of aboriginals in one of the worlds most childish tantrums.

Sing is a racist, the ICC have said so and found him guilty. However, this incident has apparently meant that India can dig up any crap to critique the world on past misdeeds. Is India so precious that it thrives on arrogance? You face a 4 – 0 thrashing unless it rains so please don’t cheapen the game by claiming umpiring would have made you better. Your team is shit.
As for Brad Hogg, this was nothing more than a stunt from the BCCI to deflect from their inability to acknowledge racism in sport. Brad Hogg apparently called Kumble a Bastard, or so the media said. Then we hear that Hogg only actually used the term ‘Bastard’ to Ricky Ponting and never directed it to any player in general, yet now he’s a racist!
You Indians whinge so much it’s little wonder you are shithouse at sport. No wonder Pakistan can’t stand you.

Naveen wrote:
January 13th, 2008 at 4.26 pm

Scott, you are talking like a hot blooded 18 year old. I wont be surprised if you aren’t. But your language is abysmal. If you are in for an India bashing session, then I must blame the moderator. I hope he really moderates the comments before getting them on to the blog, because if he doesn’t. The he will only have people spitting venom and at each other and not discussing cricket.

I hope this thread is published.

Vineet Raj Kapoor wrote:
January 13th, 2008 at 6.35 pm

I think it is silly discussing it here. There’s a court set up and they have to decide based on evidence. Peter Booth was not there, neither were you all or I. No point discussing the morality of Ponting or Tendulkar here. We all know who was not playing fair, but the racist remark allegation should be proved only in the court setup by ICC, not you or me. You can check out this article for statement of facts, just facts.

About Booth’s remark about who runs the game, obviously he knows who does right now, so no point lamenting. People have controlled various things at various times, so no pointing ruing what is today a fact. The cricketers earn their bread from the ones who pay the money.

Third point is we are discussing a racist remark not racism which is a much higher thing since it is about biases and prejudices which impact a race’s personal growth and is beyond things said in a fit of rage to each other. It is more likely to be a well thought of and continuous set of actions. Racism is something which is much beyond these silly discussions and banana courts (nothing to do with monkeys). It is much bigger and has a very ugly face, which most of the people indulging in cerebral punching here do not understand. Some of them here (going by the language they use) are much more racists than any person you know.

Please don’t leave racist remarks. I doubt if anyone’s personal knowledge about how another country works is credible enough to be celebrated. We in India can never understand that Bastard relates to your friends out there in Australia, similarly i don’t expect people in Australia to understand that monkeying around in India doesn’t mean a sadist is at work. That’s the only reason that a nation has risen to defend a thought that is alleged. (words don’t count here only the intended meaning)

Amitabh wrote:
January 14th, 2008 at 8.21 am

Scott, very unwillingly, I am driven to write that from your filthy language all you have conveyed is that your thing is bigger than your brain! That’s why you think dick, arse and all that a lot more than cricket, history and the likes.
For one, you have no sense or knowledge of most things. You are sheerly biased.
Two, Australia tries to exploit the loopholes in the cricketing rule books as much as possible - and there’s no arguing that.
Three, India lost the match to bad umpiring and not Australia. It would have been wonderful if it were possible to turn the run of events India’s way. Then one should have seen how Australia reacted. Any team in the world would protest to such fateful umpiring, let alone receiving it against the best side of the world.
More importantly, it’s Australia who are actually playing up a whole new farce. And this started in India when people were held up by the police for directing racial abuse at Symonds. They themselves are highlighting and shamefully exploiting the fact that he is not white. That’s abysmal! What if Ponting had been subjected to the same taunts. Nothing would have happened because this whole racial slur crap couldn’t have been manufactured with a white guy at the center. Aussies played up the fact the Symonds is colored — what can be worse in this world.
Now sober up and write something about cricket the next time you come on. And your vocabulary is still good if you leave dick, dickhead etal out.

Scott wrote:
January 14th, 2008 at 11.46 am

It would appear that in the mindset of Indian supporters there is no manner of ill behaviour from the elitist Indians that transgresses the rules. Australia is simply brilliant at cricket and India is pathetic, that is simple. Australia in Amitabh’s eyes exploits the rules and India in their holier than thou manner are perfect. India never appeal when they know an LBW isn’t even close, India have never ball-tampered on numerous occasions, even Tendulkar, India have never claimed a catch that wasn’t, India have never stood their ground after being bowled and India have never been involved in match-fixing or corruption! Of course I’m being cynical because India have a terribly corrupt cricket history both on and off the field and the above mentioned examples are something Indian cricketers engage in whenever they paly. It’s called cricket!

Amitabh also claims that even though Andrew Symonds was racially abused by Singh and the Indian crowds it is still Australia’s fault because they are predominantly white. Is this because of India’s hatred of the colonials or whites in general? This is the nexus of the problem. India cannot accept that racism exists in all colours, not just whites, yet their elitist mindset will not accept this fact. Sing is a racist, the India crowds are racist and the BCCI and the Indian comments in here seemingly fully approve of racial abuse.

As for the cricket. India would never have won the 2nd test, bad umpiring decisions or not, there just simply wasn’t enough time and Ponting’s declaration made sure of that. If you are still bleating on about being dudded then I would suggest you write to the BCCI and ask them to forfeit India’s test victory over England last year because Steve Bucknor dudded the English team.
India played well for a group of 2nd rate cricketers but when you have a team 6 for 134 on day 1 you should be able to bowl the remainder out but you couldn’t. To then call all Australian’s cheats, liars and raise all manner of ancillary matters to justify your rant it further highlights the deep-seated hatred that lies within the Indian mindset towards all other countries. The sad thing is that the accusations are based on your own lack of understanding of the rules, or your ignorance of them.
If you want to talk about reversing the roles so Australia is on the receiving end of bad decisions then look no further than Australia’s loss a few years ago to England in the Ashes series. The umpiring was atrocious but in the end England created all the chances, they were the better team and you just move on. No good moaning like a baby and labelling an entire nation cheats, liars and baby-killers because you lost. The umpiring wasn’t England’s fault so there is no rational reason to instantly hate them because we weren’t good enough. Sadly for India, you are so immature that throwing a tantrum is your only way to express yourselves. Grow up please.

Vineet Raj Kapoor wrote:
January 14th, 2008 at 1.22 pm

Can you stop talking countries, or even cricket histories?

I understand that not all of us know enough cricket to talk sense, but at least try to read and not write.

Anybody who has cricket brains only write hereafter please. Like I mentioned, there’s a court set up and they have to decide based on evidence. Scott, Steve, or Amitabh were not there, neither were you all or I. No point discussing the morality of Ponting or Tendulkar here. We all know who was not playing fair, but the racist remark allegations against Harbhajan and Bord Hogg should be proved only in the court setup by ICC, not you or me.

Naveen wrote:
January 14th, 2008 at 1.30 pm

Now thats good language Scott. Way to go, keep it that way.

But coming to cricket, why are we hell bent on blaming one another when the crux of the problem lays with the individual. It would be wrong to label us “Indian’s” racist. Look outside your window and you would see who is the victim here.

The superiority complex arises out of many circumstances, none of which existed in India till about a decade ago. And 10 years is too short a time for anyone to bloat up his chest and bully around the world calling everyone racist.

Talking about the Ashes series, the umpiring errors did exist, but not as one sided and as atrocious as the one in the Sydney test. At 134/6 , Australia would have been shot out for 250 or less had Symonds been given out, but then that was not to be. And then to talk about the inability of the Indians to get the Aussie tail out quickly is baseless because the Aussie’s suffered the same fate when India scored 532 after being 345/7.

Please Scott…. with all due respect, get your facts right. Now isn’t this a biased argument? We all tend to support our home team, but lets try and be as unbiased as possible. I will completely agree with you on the terribly corrupt history of Indian cricket thanks to some people. But then again, it was a few individuals.But you have to keep in mind that the current crop of cricketers play fair, Tendulkar (Although you might disagree), Kumble, Laxman & Dravid are great examples and every effort is being made to relieve India of its dark past.Pretty much similar to the South African past.

About tantrums, the Aussie team is no less expert in throwing tantrums and passing judgements. Only those teams throw a tantrum who know that their word carries a weightage. So India (being a financial superpower in Cricket) and Australia (being the best team on the field)are equally guilty of this charge in different circumstances and on different occassions.

And lastly I would say that you just hate India if you have to say that India did not stand a chance to win the 2nd test. I believe both the teams stood a chance, but India had done enough to secure a win. The fact that they got the Aussie batsman out 14 times in the 1st Innings and 8 times in the 2nd (as shown on the TV) clearly shows who bowled well. And that the Aussie bowlers deserved only 7 of the 10 Indian wickets that fell in the 2nd Innings strengthens the case. And if India really played so badly as you point out, then I really think that Australia played miserably to let the fate of the match be decided on the 8th last ball of the match.

Kumble, Tendulkar, Dravid, Ganguly and Laxman have done enough in the past to be rememembered as great or really good cricketers and any team comprising them can, by no means be called poor.

Naveen wrote:
January 14th, 2008 at 1.34 pm

Scott…..Lets learn to appreciate good cricket and great cricketers.

Stu wrote:
January 14th, 2008 at 10.14 pm

In keeping with the getting on with cricket theme (good one!) I would pose a question?

Do you think the bad decisions themselves cost India as much as there inability to cope with them. When you’re playing the top side, it is human nature to lament what might have been, but let’s not forget, in the Sydney test, both Hussey (2nd innings) and Symonds (1st innings) made 100 or more runs, EACH, AFTER the questionable decisions. While highlighting the impact of these attrocious decisions, it also highlights perhaps a weakness Anil Kumble needs to address in his charges. They need to be able to “get on with it” and take the wicket again.

The other really bad one that comes to mind, was Dravid’s dismissal late in the second innings, but let’s not forget there were 9 other wickets to fall, 3 in one over.

So can we talk cricket again? For me Shane Warne and Glen McGrath spring to mind (not because I’m racist but I’m an Aussie and that’s who I watched the most) for all their ranting and raving, when decisions did go against them (and it did happen), while no doubt complaining bitterly on the field, at the time, they had a knack of getting back to work and not letting it get too costly. India certainly didn’t manage to do this, this time.

Scott wrote:
January 15th, 2008 at 4.13 am

That’s the point Stu, if India had of only got on with the game they may have had a chance. There was no possibility of an Indian win after Australia’s 2nd Innings. Some of these Indian fans fail to remember that Ponting declared, we weren’t bowled out. If Ponting thought there was the slightest chance of an Indian victory he

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