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Loading ...Well great. play starts for 20 minutes jones and giles go out playing bad shots, then it rains again. i so hope it rains all today and tomorrow.
England v Australia, first Test, Lord’s, Day 4
By Will 5 years ago, at the end of July Add your comment below
The covers are being removed, and play could be underway shortly. Inspection at 3.15pm. Emphasis on could.
Tags: australia, england, lords, the-ashes |
33 Responses to “England v Australia, first Test, Lord’s, Day 4”
July 24th, 2005 at 4.08 pm
July 24th, 2005 at 4.29 pm
Looks like its an Eng team tactic when KP and Hoggard are batting together to give strike to Hoggard as much as possible. And there, McG gets him. Just like the Eng team wanted ! This is absolutely ridiculous stuff !!
July 24th, 2005 at 4.33 pm
So … can Warne get his five-for at Lord’s and make it to the Board?
Should KP have tried to farm the strike a bit more?
July 24th, 2005 at 4.35 pm
Yes Dave, so far KP is turning out to be the WORST batsman I have seen in terms of farming strike. Unless there is a ’strategy’ behind it ?
July 24th, 2005 at 4.45 pm
I agree – a bizarre strategy.
I guess one could try to make the case: something like, you need to play your natural game – if you try to do something different you’ll just end up getting into trouble.
And maybe at 7-down you might think the cause lost and focus on scoring runs.
Mind you, he’s looked to keep the strike now – maybe Jones had some instructions sent out with him?
… and now lost it with a four at the end of the over …
… and it’s over!
July 24th, 2005 at 4.48 pm
I dont know if this strategy helps. He was doing this in the first innings also, and there it was much more inexplicable. And here also, had be started shielding hoggard, who knows what could have happened. With some help from rain. Just imagine what would all Eng supporters feel if it rains for whole day tomorrow ?
I dont think Pieterson has proved too much beyond that he can ‘play’. He is standing out slightly better than the hopelessly out of sorts Eng order. He has shown few negatives also in the catching and strike-rotation.
July 24th, 2005 at 5.55 pm
Geraint Jones must be removed immediately. He may be a better batsman than Chris Read but this doesn’t compensate for his lack of keeping skills.
It’s a shame Thorpe has retired. The selectors should try and persuade him to return in place of Giles. I can’t see Giles doing much in this series and the batting needs reinforcing.
July 25th, 2005 at 3.18 am
Yeah Badger I’m now certainly thinking along the same lines, but Thorpe won’t come back now. Geraint Jones MUST be replaced though, and i have no doubt he will be.
It will be interesting to see how England go about the next test match, and how much closer it will be once they start getting the little things right.
July 25th, 2005 at 3.32 am
It’s an argument we (India) went through a while ago with Parthiv Patel. The better keeper ought to play. I haven’t seen Read keep or bat, though.
I think I agree about Giles. He isn’t going to do much on a seamer/batsman friendly wicket. I don’t believe it is all that defensive an option for England to play another batsman or someone like Collingwood instead, and have Vaughan bowl a few overs of off-spin.
But that’s about the only change I would make. The rest of the side is pretty good as is.
July 25th, 2005 at 4.50 am
The English selectors made a major mistake with the side that played Bangladesh. KP should have played ahead of Ian Bell. So Bell scores several thousand runs against Bangladesh and can’t be dropped. KP-predictably- earns his place in the test team through weight of runs in the ODIs. And they drop Thorpe. Bell meets Warne and McGrath and looks completely out of his depth. Thorpe announces retirement. Those foolish selectors…
however, the most frightening thing of all for the English was the cluelessness displayed by Strauss against Warne. It wasn’t pretty to watch.
July 25th, 2005 at 8.26 am
And what happened to Robert Key?
July 25th, 2005 at 9.34 am
Giles certainly seems superfulous at the moment. I just don’t see a role for him in test match cricket. I never see a wicket coming when he bowls. I understand his worth in one dayers as a defensive option but in a test you want a spinner who is more attacking minded.
I have to admit that I’m not very clued up on any potential replacements as spinner in the team. Anyone who can suggest some young, attacking spinners (any leggies???) who might be able to do a job?
July 25th, 2005 at 10.45 am
Just following on.. I’ve been pretty surprised that the papers haven’t criticised Giles more. It’s almost felt like they think he’s too nice a guy to have a go at. Which meant I had a good snigger at the Guardian’s ironic quip when talking about England’s inability to play Warne’s slider.
“They should know a bit about slow bowlers making it go straight. They do have Ashley Giles.”
July 25th, 2005 at 11.29 am
The thing about Giles is, he was never played as an attacking option. He is there to ‘hold one end up’, to be the key in defensive wkt taking tactics. In this match Eng never had enough runs to utilise Giles. He can be handy in a run-fest of a match. I can see some people in this Aus lineup (Ponting, Gilchrist, Clarke) getting frustrated and throwing away their wkt to his strategies.
But there are lots of conditions to be met for this to work, so as of now Giles should not play. Unless the pitch is spin/batsmen friendly.
And Harry, I haven’t seen G Jones in all these past good performances of Eng. Was he always ‘bad’ as a keeper (or just average ?). Because he cannot and should not be dropped on just one bad match. The criticism seems to be affecting his batting confidence also. Vaughan needs to have a chat with him.
July 25th, 2005 at 11.39 am
Well, I don’t really think that there are any replacements who would’ve played McGrath any better. He bowls six good balls an over every over and no one else on either side does that.
You can’t drop Jones on the basis of one match, but if he doesn’t raise his game then he has to go.
I rather enjoyed reading those comments about Giles – didn’t I say that before the Test?
July 25th, 2005 at 11.46 am
Unfortunately I think the Aussies see Giles as a very easy target. In a test match they can (if need be) play him defensively for an over or two to see the flight and then start tonking him, which is pretty much what they did this match.
It doesn’t really matter whether it’s a spinning wicket or not as he rarely gets any notable spin.
At the end of the day the question I think is crucial is would the Aussies would ever select a Giles type spinner (slow bowler is perhaps a better term for him)? I am pretty sure they would not…
July 25th, 2005 at 12.58 pm
Mark, agreed with your views about Giles. I was only pointing out that I dont think he has done anything wrong in ‘this’ match. Most probably the Aus would play him well. He may have his day (or session) in case of a high scoring match on a flat track against them.
And as for Aus selecting Giles…hmm…I dont think Aus would have selected anyone from the b’desh side to which they lost ! Or even from the WI test team (except Lara) they lost a test match to. Point being, you dont necessarily need players of same calibre as Aus, atleast not all 11 of them. Its a media gimmick created mostly by Eng media, helped (to their advantage) by Aus players.
July 25th, 2005 at 1.16 pm
Agreed. Although I didn’t mean to make a comment on whether Giles has the calibre to make an Aus team. What I meant was that Giles’ bowling is used as a negative tactic rather than a positive one and the Australian team is not known for containing such players.
Australia don’t worry if Warne goes for a few runs now and then because they know that he’ll get wickets. England have generally been scared of such a philosphy (perhaps because we haven’t had the batting to back it up) which is partly why Tufnell’s England carrier was so disrupted.
July 25th, 2005 at 1.22 pm
I wrote a rather long comment, but realised my thoughts could be summed up far more succinctly. Drop no-one, do not change the personnel. Just play better.
The batting need to improve – three of the top six failed to get into double-figures in either innings – but as a unit as much as anything. Partnerships are, as ever, key. Dropping players and chopping and changing the order is hardly a foolproof method for increasing the batting’s cohesiveness.
Likewise the attack. The seam attack is generally good, and no-one in county cricket is pushing for a call-up. And, no matter how much gnashing of teeth it causes, there are no viable alternatives to Giles. Dropping him for a batsmen (probably Collingwood) really is the best option, especially on a seaming wicket.
The fielding is poor, a real drop from the one-day series in particular. Chris Read’s been batting well this year (he scored a hundred while shepherding the tail recently – Pietersen should take note), but Jones did keep well in the one-day matches, and seems to have a good character.
July 25th, 2005 at 1.23 pm
mark: the thing is, Warne really doesn’t go for runs. That’s part of what makes him great – he’s a stock bowler and an attacking leg-spinner at the same time.
July 25th, 2005 at 1.32 pm
Hmm…I would rather think that Giles kind of bowlers are more effective on batting friendly pitches. Lots of runs to be made, opponents know you’ve piled up runs(or will do so) and thus frustrate them with negative lines. Therefore in low scoring games, frustration tactics dont work. Also note that Giles success has come recently when Eng batting has started clicking more successfully (that almost seems so long ago 
)
Do you remember how Giles was successfully used by Hussain against Ind on their last tour ? He didnt get too many wkts, but was successful in frustrating the batsmen, while more effective bowlers worked at the other end. He even got Sachin stumped in 90s !! I dont know if you would realise how big it is. Sachin is not only the one of the best players of spin (better than all Aussies anyways) but also the most patient and correct of batsmen against spinners. He’s probably never before been stumped, and hardly ever been out in 90s.
…but i ramble
July 25th, 2005 at 1.36 pm
Geoff, nice point that about batting with tail. KP really needs to learn that. He got last 3 wkts of Eng exposed on day 4 (see my comments above #2, #4, #6). Btw, can anyone confirm if its raining at Lords today ? Just wanted to know if Eng paid for his bad tactics.
July 25th, 2005 at 1.38 pm
Hmm. I guess I’m just frustrated. I understand what you’re saying Worma but it doesn’t offer much solace when you’ve seen some truly great spin bowling by Warne where you felt a wicket might come every ball and the compare it to the toothlessness of Giles in the same match.
I know it’s unfair to compare Warne and Giles but..
Perhaps I’m not patient enough to appreciate the qualities of Ashley!
July 25th, 2005 at 1.44 pm
The forecast at lords today was scattered showers with bright spells later on in the day (i could be a weather man). Still i think England could not have relied on the weather to save the match for them, after our bad fielding there was only going to be one winner of the match with the aussies with an unbeatable lead. i still think G.Jones should not be dropped after one bad match,i know the catches he dropped should be regulation catches, but the selectors shouldnt drop him after one bad match
July 25th, 2005 at 1.46 pm
worma: he also bowled with attacking fields and with great success against the West Indies last summer.
Of course, that was mostly to their left-handers, and Vaughan had him face a well-set Clarke and Martyn first up.
mark: I know what you mean, especially when there are decent appeals for leg-before every other ball and Hayden holds everything.
July 25th, 2005 at 2.03 pm
Completely off topic – The best selling newspaper here in Sweden ran a ‘100 best ever sportsmen’ list yesterday. Lists like this are always done primarily to get people riled up but this one displayed a new level in journalistic ignorance.
I wasn’t expecting a cricketer in the list as the sport isn’t covered here but lo and behold they stuck in one at place 82. Who you may ask? Bradman, Sobers, Warne? No.. Imran Khan.
So there you go. Imran Khan, the greatest ever cricketer according to the Swedes!
July 25th, 2005 at 2.17 pm
Imran Khan..LOL. Probably they didnt expect anyone to recognise the name (or even the sport), just went for their favourite. Or maybe asked the local asian dude in the ofc
Geoff, I can understand Giles attacking the WI batsmen, they (along with SA) are the worst against spin. But if I know correctly, Giles has mostly been used as the defensive wkt taker.
July 25th, 2005 at 10.31 pm
Imran! Hey, it’s the Swedes: no doubt they respected his work in the pants department.
“… like a tiger … grrrrr”
(Strictly for fans of The Late Show … I’m sorry if this makes no sense for the rest of you!)
July 25th, 2005 at 11.47 pm
LOL! Dave, I loved The Late Show!! I wonder what Graham and the Colonel think about this Ashes series? 
July 26th, 2005 at 7.35 am
Worma sorry for the late reply but yes Jones has never been the best of keepers! He had/has improved a lot but i don’t think England can afford to give him another chance. England lost the first match so they diffently need to win the second and a bad mistake or two from him could lose them the second test. You can not afford to have a sub-standed keeper, i don’t care how much he’s improved, how well he can bat or whether chopping and changing the team is bad or not. Bottom line is, he is NOT good enough
July 26th, 2005 at 12.37 pm
Yes i agree harry that jones cannot afford to make anymore mistakes, but what about KP who dropped three catches and freddy who dropped one? the team should not be changed, Jones knows he has a huge amount of pressure on him to perform with the gloves on aswell as with the bat and the selectors and Vaughan need to have a word with him to get his confidence he has taken some great catches in the past few months but also dropped some dollys.
July 27th, 2005 at 10.24 am
Look, i’ve seen a lot of Jones, and after this comment i won’t argue anymore, but i’m telling you now he is completely useless. Sure, he can generally take the easy and simple catches (usually) but have you seen the bloke try and take the return throws from fielders? It’s like watching a school boy trying to dodge balls on the middle of the court. It all comes down to his footwork which is absolutely atrocious. His performances are sometimes completely comical. This bad footwork often leads to drop catches when they are slight more difficult, like one diving to his right in the first test.
August 28th, 2005 at 2.56 pm
G. Jones MUST be dropped, i really dont care how many runs he scores with the bat.. his job is as wicket keeper, if you add up the number of catches he drops (regulation ones at that) and the number of byes he gives away then its insane to keep him in the squad. If i see another person say that hes done so well with the bat, or ohhh look he made up for it all by catching a bread and butter edge, then ill go nuts
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